Here is the comment:
You need to get over that suburban black being better than inner city black attitude. I sort of got the feeling that you were better than that. But let me tell you this...the same way that you refer to his wife as ghetto trash, you are considered trash as well. I dont care about how "WHITE" you sound or the fact that you have a white husband or the fact that you are from the suburbs... In fact, I guarantee that you have been considered trash by some of those white boys that you "LOVE" so much. It would only take a heated argument for it to come out. You need to get over yourself.
I never once said that I was better than an inner city black. I have no clue if his wife is an inner city black, which to me speaks volumes on this persons insecurity. I have dealt with this my whole life, and I don't really understand it. I also want to note that a "It would only take a heated argument for it to come out. You need to get over yourself." speaks volumes. Never once have I said I am better than anyone. I see myself as damaged goods, not because of where I live or where I come from, but I as I said to someone via email the other day, I don't fit in. I am "too black" to be white, "too white" to be black. I talk and act too white, but I look too black. It confuses people, they keep their distance. In terms of my "superiority" coming out in a heated argument, why would you expect anything to come out? Why would you expect me to do anything? Was an opinion already formed in your mind and this was your chance to pounce?
Also note, I will proudly proclaim to anyone I am one generation removed from the "ghetto" and the country. I said this at the other blog, I will say it here, being poor does not automatically mean ghetto, nor does being wealthy equate to having class. If I felt that way, I would have to disown members of my own family, including my grandparents and some uncles and aunts. I don't do that. I love my family, even the ones who have hurt me. The ones who make fun of the way I talk. That did the "I told you she was white" when I married my husband. The ones who told my mother that she was going to get knocked off her pedestal and just because she married my father, got a degree, and moved her kids into a "white area" didn't mean she wasn't black any more, and that the white people would always think of her as a "n*gger."
Hell, to be honest those family members do have a point, no one ever forgets I am black with my dark skin, curly black hair, broad nose, and full lips. Even when I went through my period of "discovering my blackness", when I tried to assimilate with black folks, I still couldn't. Per some I still "acted white", and I was told by one girl I sound liked a white girl talking black when I tried to sound "more ethnic."
Some of the reasons for my I think I am better than others would kill me as well. Some of the best were
....Because you got good hair (I had everything to do with my hair texture)
....Because you have a daddy.
....Because you went to college.
....Because you live in a brick house (that was from some country folk)
....Because you talk to white folks (hello I had no choice, unless I wanted to be alone and have no friends)
I can't win. My parents received this type of treatment at times. They often would get the "forgot where you came from speeches" when money wouldn't be loaned after the first three loans initially given were never paid back. When they wouldn't pay for the whole tab, or put money on books for folks in jail. When crack heads would ask to come over while unsupervised.
I want to note, my father fought tooth and nail to prove he was still in the neighborhood. My dad ran agriculture programs (yes my father is in agriculture) for the teens in the neighborhood he grew up in. Sought interns from his alma mater, Prairie View A&M. My mother quit her job teaching in the suburbs to go to an inner city school, she wanted to make a difference. These are not people who moved off and became ashamed of their upbringing, but they were no longer black enough because they didn't live in the heart of the "ghetto" or "poverty" they once came from.
How does one fit in, how does one prove themselves to be "normal"?
****Disclaimer***** To make sure that people don't think I am twisting comments or words and quotes, you can see the quote that inspired the whole transaction in it's entirety on C1`s blog. Please do not go there to derail his topic, if you want to yell at me and tell me how horrible I am come here to do it. He made a great post and I do not want to deflect from that. Also note that the quote did not come from the person I was talking to, but rather someone wanting to defend him.
25 comments:
you said: In terms of my "superiority" coming out in a heated argument, why would you expect anything to come out?
actually i think your criticizer meant that in a heated argument, the white boys that you 'love' will reveal how they really feel about you: which is that you are trash to them.
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this is just another example of an individual who is unsatisfied because you don't fit into the category they created for you in their head. i'm sure if you were ghetto as hell and liberally threw around some ebonics, he would be perfectly happy with you. but no; you dare to question and discard stereotypes typically associated with AA's. you've even risen above them, or never even had to claim any number of those stereotypes. there in, lies this individual's problem.
rubbish i say. dirt off your shoulder. or as i often like to assert: NEXT!
I think the only place for people like us (those of us who have heard: "you talk white," "you think you're better than everybody,") to fit in is with other people like us. I know what it's like to be talked down to about not being "typically" black. The message I got was that they were insecure about someone disturbing their narrow world view.
Sometimes I think that when people who are poor see other people they perceive as being like them trying to do something different for themselves, they really misunderstand what that person is trying to do.
For example, in an inservice that we had for my school we watched a video about a white family who lived in a trailer home. The mother worked a couple of low wage jobs to support her two sons. One of the sons was doing well in school and was working toward college. She said to those filming and to the son himself that he was trying to forget where he came from and that he thought he was better than the rest of them. It was as if she felt rejected by the fact he was doing something different than what their family had been doing for generations.
I believe that people think that I've turned my back on being black, but I haven't. I'm aware of who I am and of my roots, but that doesn't mean I can't be or do whatever I want in order to shape my own life.
Siddity you are who you are. You can't please all of the people all of the time. And more importantly the only people you need to please happen to be the people living in your house (you and your husband).
Sometimes you have to ask people how am I am different from you? Are we both not after the same things in life love, security, friendship? When you put these questions to people and they answer honestly then you may have succeeded in correcting any possible misconceptions. If they answer with a BUT then forget them they are set into playing the victim game and are no longer worth the time and effort.
I think you just get to a certain stage in life where you pretty much just brush those comments off. Growing up I used to hate family gatherings because I always heard the old tired line "You talk white".. whatever man, I am not even listening to that crap.
I know I have family members that probably call me an Oreo because my husband is white, what can you do about it.
Fact is whether we live in the hood or the burbs, we still deal with the same societal racism and crap. Instead of getting caught on the little details, I just try and focus on the large stuff.
Siditty, I know the kind of people this guy is talking about. Ya know, people who are one step removed from South Dallas, but one missed mortgage payment and it's back to the bottom they go.
This. Ain't. You.
You can remember your roots and still embrace education, home ownership, a stable marriage, etc. I thought the whole point was to do better than the previous generation.
But that must only be for White folks, too.
t was as if she felt rejected by the fact he was doing something different than what their family had been doing for generations.
My dad's father was a butcher and he encouraged him to get a job and not go to college, if you can believe that. My dad's family look at him kind of funny as they were blue collar workers and he was a scientist.
Siditty: That guy is nuts, move on. Why is it that these IR blogs attract batshit crazy guys?
Brush it off and smile that you make him so uncomfy girl.
As for people (family/friends/strangers) talking about you, it aint never going to end so you must as well get used to it and enjoy the ride :)
If you have folks sitting talking about you, then you must be that much important... Or atleast that's what I believe.
Siditty, you have a wonderful husband, you are an articulate writer and speaker and some people are so brainwashed how black people should be and because they are not, they are furious and confused. You need concentrate on the wonderful future you have with your husband and be who you are, and that Mr, he needs to get over himself. That man needs peace!
@emeritus: "...you dare to question and discard stereotypes typically associated with AA's. you've even risen above them, or never even had to claim any number of those stereotypes. there in, lies this individual's problem."
B-I-N-G-O!
any time we refuse to live up to a tired old stereotype or seek out new opportunities, we're accused of "thinking we're better..."
ummm....food for thought, but....maybe we ARE?
not being "elitist" here, but what's WRONG with wanting to see what the world has to offer? to venture beyond the block/trailer park/project you grew up in? to pick up a damn book AND read it?
"..in a heated argument, the white boys that you 'love' will reveal how they really feel about you: which is that you are trash to them."
...uh...Black men are capable of doing this too...
my response: bite me!
Hey I've lurk on many irr blogs occasionally I may post a comment. I'm also married with beautiful biracial kids.
I don't know why you're offended by this I've been reading your blog and many others where you post. The way you reply and comment on blogs sometimes is very insulting and rude. That is the image I have of you, of an easily angered person quick to give a indignant response. While this guy may have said some clueless things your responses were very uncall for and in real life you probably would never come at him like that in my opinion. Then you run to your blog and make a post about it without providing a link or stating that the comment came from another poster defending him. I find that very childish in it self. Grow up or stay out of adult conversion if your so easily offended.
And please I don't care about your background whether it was ghetto, middle class or rich. Just stop thinking that you can be rude as hell and get away with it because you have a few blog fans. Stop this nonsense it only sounds like you lack class.
"Siditty: That guy is nuts, move on. Why is it that these IR blogs attract batshit crazy guys?"
I thought it was a female and she has been attacking people on various blogs. Its not the first time. That person just has their own issues.
Like C1 said, this behavior is common and its across races. Even with in families there is that need to remain at the established level.
But let us not forget too the importance of identity. People do get lost out there and sometimes people need to be reminded of their roots. That is how communities are built.
Its a tricky balance between an individual being who they want to be and also maintaining a relationship with the community. No one is an island, its a juggling act. After all when something hard hits you because of your race, who do you run to? So in exchange for that support the community feels it has a hold on you. Unless you can forfeit your black privilages you will always have voices telling you when they feel you are wandering off too far.
...Because you talk to white folks (hello I had no choice, unless I wanted to be alone and have no friends)
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ERGH NO NO NO : speak in way that most people understand and do not use slang ! ...i sorta skimmed thru so i may have to go re read
this is just another example of an individual who is unsatisfied because you don't fit into the category they created for you in their head. i'm sure if you were ghetto as hell and liberally threw around some ebonics, he would be perfectly happy with you. but no; you dare to question and discard stereotypes typically associated with AA's. you've even risen above them, or never even had to claim any number of those stereotypes. there in, lies this individual's problem. rubbish i say. dirt off your shoulder. or as i often like to assert: NEXT!
Emeritus:
Yeah that is what I am going to have to do.
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I think the only place for people like us (those of us who have heard: "you talk white," "you think you're better than everybody,") to fit in is with other people like us. I know what it's like to be talked down to about not being "typically" black. The message I got was that they were insecure about someone disturbing their narrow world view.
Kyleth,
I sometimes think that, but I have found some really great friends, who even though they might have had some "she thinks she is white" perceptions of me when they first meet me, they have actually put forth the time and effort to know me and I find them to be great people. I will admit though most of the people I hang with were like me, they never really fit in. They were too nerdy, too white, too weird, etc.
The mother worked a couple of low wage jobs to support her two sons. One of the sons was doing well in school and was working toward college. She said to those filming and to the son himself that he was trying to forget where he came from and that he thought he was better than the rest of them. It was as if she felt rejected by the fact he was doing something different than what their family had been doing for generations.
That mother felt scared that her son would want to better himself, because I think in her mind she felt what she wasn't doing was enough, even though in reality it very well could be the absolute best. To have a son headed in the right path shouldn't be seen as a threat, but a reflection of the way you raised your child.
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Sometimes you have to ask people how am I am different from you? Are we both not after the same things in life love, security, friendship? When you put these questions to people and they answer honestly then you may have succeeded in correcting any possible misconceptions. If they answer with a BUT then forget them they are set into playing the victim game and are no longer worth the time and effort.
Jazzy,
You are definitely right, most people want similar things in life, they just might go about things differently, but the goal is the same.
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Fact is whether we live in the hood or the burbs, we still deal with the same societal racism and crap. Instead of getting caught on the little details, I just try and focus on the large stuff.
This is so very true. No one who is racist is going to really differentiate me from another black person, and if they do, they might hate me more if they perceive me to be an "uppity negro".
My dad's father was a butcher and he encouraged him to get a job and not go to college, if you can believe that. My dad's family look at him kind of funny as they were blue collar workers and he was a scientist.
My grandfather gave my mom 8 dollars for college, as he was sure she would be back if she had no money to attend. Her and stafford became BFFs and she never went back home LOL
My grandfather has always treated my mother as if she abandoned the family, it is like he doesn't know how to relate to her, or us. We didn't live right down the road, but rather hours away, like the rest of the family, so in his eyes she left the family to forget them. I don't know. Families are weird.
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Siditty: That guy is nuts, move on. Why is it that these IR blogs attract batshit crazy guys?
Roz,
I have yet to figure it out, but the crazies do love the IR blogs.
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Brush it off and smile that you make him so uncomfy girl. As for people (family/friends/strangers) talking about you, it aint never going to end so you must as well get used to it and enjoy the ride :) If you have folks sitting talking about you, then you must be that much important... Or atleast that's what I believe.
That is what my momma used to say Soila, you are right :)
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Siditty, you have a wonderful husband, you are an articulate writer and speaker and some people are so brainwashed how black people should be and because they are not, they are furious and confused. You need concentrate on the wonderful future you have with your husband and be who you are, and that Mr, he needs to get over himself. That man needs peace!
Thank you Felicity
any time we refuse to live up to a tired old stereotype or seek out new opportunities, we're accused of "thinking we're better..." ummm....food for thought, but....maybe we ARE? not being "elitist" here, but what's WRONG with wanting to see what the world has to offer? to venture beyond the block/trailer park/project you grew up in? to pick up a damn book AND read it?
LOL, there is nothing wrong with wanting to see what the world has to offer. I think sometimes in certain cultures or communities there is such a strong need to "stick together" when you think outside the box of what is the "norm" it scares people.
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Mad season,
So to call me a person who lacks class, who is rude, indignant, childish, and to grow up says what about you? What about your response was what would be considered objective, constructive criticism? Insulting people is the only route you knew to take in your "adult" argument.
Then you run to your blog and make a post about it without providing a link or stating that the comment came from another poster defending him.
I will gladly say it was a person who frequent lurks on my blog and goes to other blogs in which she talks about how mean and evil I am that I am bashing and hate black women. I will not however turn a great post that C1 created into a long drawn out fight about a topic that isn't related to his post. In terms of why I created this topic, that was not the first time someone in real life or the internet has felt the need to point this out. My question is why? People I never have interacted with or talked to would give this response. That was the main objective of this post, the incident at the other blog just gave me a blog idea. I don't know if you even read this post in it's entirety, as it seems your objective here was just to insult me and approach me in a way that in real life you wouldn't. Because if you honestly think your insults were a way to "correct me" and would work in a workplace in real life, you are strongly mistaken.
Just stop thinking that you can be rude as hell and get away with it because you have a few blog fans.
I don't have fans, people read this mess of a blog because C1 and was sweet and gracious enough to put a link on his wildly popular blog on the side of his page. My "support" on the blogs come from him and people like Yan, Grata, Soila, Casper, and many others who lurk around and aren't as vocal, but yet nice and kind of understand me and my craziness as best as one can on the internet.
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I thought it was a female and she has been attacking people on various blogs. Its not the first time. That person just has their own issues. Like C1 said, this behavior is common and its across races. Even with in families there is that need to remain at the established level. But let us not forget too the importance of identity. People do get lost out there and sometimes people need to be reminded of their roots. That is how communities are built.
Grata the person before you wanted to paint the picture of an innocent blogger. HPK or Ava are not angels or saints, Ava has attacked me multiple times and HPK has on more than one occasion said some very insulting things.
In terms of an "establishment", I think many people do feel abandoned when someone succeeds. Not that the person who has managed to succeed has truly abandoned them, but it hurts to know that they could try if needed to.
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LOL @
ERGH NO NO NO : speak in way that most people understand and do not use slang ! ...i sorta skimmed thru so i may have to go re read
lol Siditty your response is exactly what I expect it would be. Sorry I don't have time to discipline children on the Internet. Stop trying to look for "enemies" where there is none.
lol Siditty your response is exactly what I expect it would be. Sorry I don't have time to discipline children on the Internet. Stop trying to look for "enemies" where there is none.
Again showing your non biased criticism.
I don't have enemies on the internet.
Note how you can't refute one claim that was said.
"....Because you got good hair (I had everything to do with my hair texture)
....Because you have a daddy.
....Because you went to college.
....Because you live in a brick house (that was from some country folk)
....Because you talk to white "
I had to LMAO at all of these comments, because I have heard all of these as well. I even once had a girl tell me that I thought I was white because I didn’t put enough grease in my hair. WTF?!? I always attributed some of this ignorance to the fact that I moved to the south from the northeast, I never heard these comments before then, but who knows it may be all over the US. Here’s the deal, people are products of their environment, if you grow up in the suburbs, surrounded mostly by whites that will shape who you are. If your parents encouraged education and using proper grammar that will shape who you are. My parents both have Masters Degrees, my father is from Nigeria, and my mother is a teacher, I had no choice but to speak proper English, go to college and become a productive member of society, they weren’t having it any other way. That was my experience, everyone has a different story.
I spent a lot of time as well, when I was younger trying to “be more black”, but now as a grown ass woman I have decided to be who I feel comfortable being. I am a very dark-skinned Black woman, how in the hell could I never not be Black. I enjoy what I enjoy and I am who I am, if anyone wants to criticize or feels I should act in another fashion shouldn’t spend time with me. What ever you do in life Siditty, always be true to you.
I sometimes think that, but I have found some really great friends, who even though they might have had some "she thinks she is white" perceptions of me when they first meet me, they have actually put forth the time and effort to know me and I find them to be great people. I will admit though most of the people I hang with were like me, they never really fit in. They were too nerdy, too white, too weird, etc.
There's a reason why I feel this way. I feel as if I try too hard and I give people the benefit of the doubt too often. I really do think that if people get to know me they'd really like me, but there have been a lot of people who look at me funny because of a) my dialect b) the assorted "middle class" stuff I do. I have had one really good friend who didn't really care about all that except for calling me the blackest white girl she's ever seen. I do admit that I do just feel more comfortable around nerds who commit acts of geekery. I understand the irony in my being as uncomfortable with people being different as others are with me.
"The way you reply and comment on blogs sometimes is very insulting and rude. That is the image I have of you, of an easily angered person quick to give a indignant response".
Madseason,
I am not sure which blogs you have been reading but your description of Sid is SO off the mark. You must be bothered by something else.
And if you really do read Sid's posts on other blogs then you must have witnessed villagers' fights. And having been personally involved in some pretty nasty fights with Sid, I will still say that your assessment of her is off.
I wrote an article in college that relates to issues similar to this. Why is it that if we use "standard american english" we have to be looked down upon or seen as acting "white"? And if we keep our natural locks and take pride in our culture, we are viewed as being "too black"? If you so happen to live in a relatively decent neighborhood, so many people will automatically assume that you live in a "white" neighborhood, I guarantee it. And although some of those assumptions have some weight, there are still very responsible, highly educated, hard-working, black families, just as there are some poor, single-family, struggling white families. As blacks have fought to come up in this country, of course it has been a struggle, and we sometimes get the short end of the stick- but don't expect me to grovel and pretend as though we don't have a right to want more from our society. Standing up for yourself and going after your desires, does not make you a traitor to your race, it makes you a success to your race, and hopefully soon we all will begin to realize this. Siditty, continue to be yourself, and love yourself just the way you are. It's impossible to satisfy everyone...sometimes either you're too black or too white. But if you continue to remain true to yourself, that's all that matters. You truly have inspired me to write something about this problem we have in our society. Thank you so much for sharing...
Kei
http://therevealedoasis.blogspot.com
I even once had a girl tell me that I thought I was white because I didn’t put enough grease in my hair. WTF?!?
I was told by a cousin I thought I was white because I wore my hair natural and did wash and gos. I didn't understand, my hair is no where near the "average" white person hair type.
Your family is like mine. Both my mom and dad have their Masters, except my parents are country. My dad is from Waco, TX and my mom is from East Texas LOL. My mother is also a teacher, and I am an aspiring teacher. :fingers crossed:: I plan to work on my master's during summers and hopefully a PhD.
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There's a reason why I feel this way. I feel as if I try too hard and I give people the benefit of the doubt too often. I really do think that if people get to know me they'd really like me, but there have been a lot of people who look at me funny because of a) my dialect b) the assorted "middle class" stuff I do. I have had one really good friend who didn't really care about all that except for calling me the blackest white girl she's ever seen. I do admit that I do just feel more comfortable around nerds who commit acts of geekery. I understand the irony in my being as uncomfortable with people being different as others are with me.
I do give people the benefit of the doubt a lot, and many times it burns me, but other times it doesn't.
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I am not sure which blogs you have been reading but your description of Sid is SO off the mark. You must be bothered by something else. And if you really do read Sid's posts on other blogs then you must have witnessed villagers' fights. And having been personally involved in some pretty nasty fights with Sid, I will still say that your assessment of her is off.
Grata,
Don't worry it is just another evangelical who can't even prove their accusations. Notice they didn't come back, they had nothing of value to say.
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And although some of those assumptions have some weight, there are still very responsible, highly educated, hard-working, black families, just as there are some poor, single-family, struggling white families. As blacks have fought to come up in this country, of course it has been a struggle, and we sometimes get the short end of the stick- but don't expect me to grovel and pretend as though we don't have a right to want more from our society. Standing up for yourself and going after your desires, does not make you a traitor to your race, it makes you a success to your race, and hopefully soon we all will begin to realize this
Kei,
Thanks for the kind words. What you said hits the nail right on the head. We as blacks should want better, and not chastise though who do better. I see it as a sign of insecurity and weakness when that happens. Why be a victim of stereotypes? Why embrace them?
Love your blog by the way.
So the only people who criticize you are evangelical lol. Sorry to bust your bubble I’m not even Christian. I just don't like rude people and before I came to that conclusion I read all your blogs and many other altercations you've had on the internet with other bloggers and commentators.
Evangelical is not in reference to your religion. How many other altercations have I had, and better yet, why do you have so much time to follow me around in blog land to observe them? Also note, you keep coming to a blog in which you claim you can't stand the person who writes it, so what is really going on.
You would think with as much time you had to observe me, you would know what I reference when I say "evangelical"
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