I was over at the blog Beautiful Black Woman-Thoughts of a White B'woy, and he had an entry about his taste and how some people tell him his he has horrible taste in women. He prefers black women, but the gamut of black women is vast, at least on his site. He has some that are model thin, others who are "thick", others who are light skinned, some dark skinned, some with relaxed hair, others with naturals or locs. He basically just likes black women.
Now I know that friends can influence each other. I know I have adapted sayings that my friends tell me, or started liking certain types of music that I wouldn't otherwise have been interested in if I weren't around the people who exposed me to them. Do you think that your taste in what you find attractive can also be influenced by friends? If you are a black girl who is attracted to white guys, and your friends start saying negative things about white men, would you be inclined to keep your preference on the down low, or pretend you preference doesn't even exist and deny it? Same for white guys, I know guys are pretty much into the physical and looks are probably more important to a man than a woman in most instances, but if you friends pretty much weren't into black women, and didn't think they were attractive, but yet you yourself were attracted to them, would you share your preference with them, or keep it a secret? Or deny it? I know many a white guy who have told me they are attracted to black women, but would be a bit apprehensive about dating one, just because it is a new taboo. It seems some men have to "work their way up" to black women. They are scared of what friends and family would think, or know what they would think and don't want to deal with the hassle.
Would you deny who you are attracted to, because you know how your friends would react?
PS: I found on the blog, the link to a dating site targeted to black women. Men Love Black Women aka menlovebw.com. I guess it might be worth checking out, I can't check it out due to husband reasons, and that would look suspect, so don't yell at me, if it ends up being a dud. Just thought I would pass on the information.
39 comments:
I think friends definitly influence your taste. I've had experiences where its as if the group polarizes in terms fo what they find attractive. an average person becomes "so hot," just by general consensus. its so stupid.
Well, I've already resigned to the fact that I'm odd, so I stopped caring about how others would react to any of my tastes a long time ago. I don't have any preference in men along racial lines, though. If he's a decent guy and treats me like a queen (*smile*), he could be magenta-blue for all I care. I'm the one in the relationship, not my friends.
the opinions of peers definitely influence who people choose to date, not that they don't have their own mind but being ostracized is no joke
I think that if your friends do not approve you just keep your preferences to yourself unless you become really serious about someone.
Up until 18 I was all about medium to dark skin black guys. Then I started noticing cute light black guys and I noticed people did not approve, there is some sort of taboo in the community with high yellow men being considered masculine. I definitely get teased for this. People also think it is strange that I find younger guys attractive. Mostly it is just eye candy because the younger guys I have tried to date were not mature enough. But I see nothing wrong with admiring a hot 21 year old NBA player. I think I like the fact that they are still in shape and so many guys my age have let themselves go.
In college I had a a goofy NSync poster in my dorm room. Well the black guys on my floor that I hung out with discussed this among themselves and decided I only dated white guys. Then they assumed I only dated light skin blacks. One of them complained to me about this assumed preference and I pointed out the fact that he had Tyra, Alicia and Beyonce on his walls.
The weird things is I actually find a variety of skin tones attractive but they think in binary terms and can't get their mind around the fact that I find both Stephen Curry and Kevin Garnet attractive.
I've always dated white men and my attraction to *certain* white men is well known by my girlfriends who have never criticized or made fun of my preference.
4 out of 6 of my gfs (BW) are with WM anyway,(the other two are with a BM and a HM) so if anything, we understand that we're entitled to our own unique tastes in men, regardless of their race or skin colour.
I think friends can definitely influence each others taste, but I think whether or nor someone refuse to date someone they're attracted to because of their friends depends on the person. If the person is secure and self-confident in themselves, they'll date whoever they want with little regard for whether or not their friends have bad taste. On the other hand, if someone is really concerned about other folks opinions, then that could very well stop them.
A friend of mine (she's white) told me she would never date a black guy, although she's found a couple black guys attractive. Even if he was the perfect match for her, she wouldn't date him because she doesn't think society would be accepting of her kids. I told her that who cares about society? At the end of the day she has to live her life for her, not for what other people think.
I've pretty much let it be known to my Nigerian Student Assoc on campus that I am interested in white men, that love comes in all colors and that I am perfectly willing to tap into that universal abundance (as I like to call it).
While many agree that they shouldn't limit themselves, they also make it clear that their first choice will always be a Nigerian man.
What really kills me is the general consensus that if a Nigerian girl is to date outside of her race, esp. if she chooses to date a WM, he has to be extremely good looking. Usually the girl telling me this is not the prettiest of the bunch. They [some of my friends] always conveniently fail to take into consideration how their own attractiveness might play a part in getting that handsome WM. If you're ugly, is he supposed to ignore your face and be grateful he's getting picked by a Naija girl?
They also tend to downplay the attractiveness of non Nigerian and AA men. I showed them a picture of one of the most handsomest white guys I know. He's so good looking, even guys admit to his attractiveness. My Naija friends' reply? "Oh he's cute."
Cute? That's all you can come up with? Makes me so mad.
So basically the point of my rant is that my friends don't influence my taste. :-)
Do my friends and/or fam influence my tastes? No. My friends appear to be a bit more accepting of my attraction to white and latino men. My family is not accepting of the attraction to white but they can tolerate it if I'm speaking of some hot Latino guy. My brother likes to make fun of black women who date or marry IR saying they are ugly or whatever. I can't wait to be around him when he sees a black woman that he feels is desirable with a white guy, LOL. Lo and behold he won't seriously date a woman darker than a certain hue...go figure.
I never really have to admit that I prefer nonblack men since most people find it obvious when I speak of a hot guy I met. But when asked, I do not deny it.
The only outside influence of taste that I have is when it comes to religion. I classify myself as an exChristian and virtually all of my friends are still born-Again Christians. Thus, I will only get involved with someone who either is or at least from a Christian background. So that is the only situation where my tastes are clearly influenced.
My brother likes to make fun of black women who date or marry IR saying they are ugly or whatever. I can't wait to be around him when he sees a black woman that he feels is desirable with a white guy, LOL. Lo and behold he won't seriously date a woman darker than a certain hue...go figure. My thing if all these women are ugly, why even mention that they are in IR, you didn't want them anyway. I hear this often and it kills me. They never say this when they AA guy is dating the 10 years older grossly overweight white woman with a bad dye job, they just focus on black women. I remember a black man telling me that a black man would never want me if me and my husband were ever to split because I am "tainted". I told him that was fine, I would just date another white guy. He got mad, but hey if I am not wanted by one group, I am sure there are folks in another group that are willing and able.
I always find these same men who get upset about black women dating IR are the first to have a paper bag test requirement for the women they choose to date.
Its called peer pressure. I believe in psychology it is believed that is one of the main influences in one's life after family.
So if one's family is against them dating black and the peers believe the same, what chances has the American White male got to go against the grain?
I am very apprehensive towards White, especially American males, the societal pressures against such a combination are too much for them. That is why many only do this after maturing abit. That is usually after a few divorces and when they are beginning to age and realize that they are not as precious as they were told.
The White women are said to have a princess complex while white men have the "I am above all of you" complex.
With time and serious social changes with minorities increasing debunking myths, as these people age so do their beliefs in who they think they are.
So generally white men will continue to avoid Black women while they are in their youth. They are "better" than that.
White women on the other hand continue to benefit from their princess complex because it doesn't get in the way of interrating with non white men. While for the White male, that superiority complex tells him that the Black woman is beneth him.
When I was around 9 years old and had a crush on a white boy I had friends call me an oreo and a sellout. Of course this was upsetting because I was a child, but I realized even at a young age that I had to be me. Since then (almost 20 years ago, yikes) I've always been pretty upfront about my preferences and i haven't gotten too much push back. I also can count the number of non-familial female friends that I have, so that may make a difference as well.
I will agree with anon @ 1104 that "an average person becomes "so hot," just by general consensus. its so stupid.". Totally the case in Jr/Sr high school, especially when you look back now.
My family has had a few interracial marriages, so no one ever said "stop dating that white boy", they were more apt to say, "stop dating that loser" if the term applied regardless of race/background.
NO. I don't let my friends or family influence who I date. I'm the one to be in the relationship, not them so, they have no say. That said, it's always nice if your family and friends like who you date/marry.
Plain and simple: No
If my friends are really my friends, they will respect my taste and leave it at that...end of story. If they don't respect it, they're free to go.
"I always find these same men who get upset about black women dating IR are the first to have a paper bag test requirement for the women they choose to date."
This is why the battle against racism is truly lost. How can I fight for the freedom of Black men when they themselves will turn around and discriminate against me because of my skin tone?
Black women, you better learn to pick your battles wisely.
lol @ "husband reasons"
I think my black male friends would be more likely to respond negatively to me dating a white guy than would the black female friends of mine.
But I think their reaction to me dating interracially would be tame compared to what they'd do if they found out I'm no longer Christian but agnostic.
Grata, I think you made a very interesting point. In all honesty, I have been attending college for a few years now, and for the love of me, could not seem to figure out why the white males on campus NEVER dated the black females??? The white females on campus openly did it, but the white males, no matter how friendly I was, how flirtatious, how beautiful I looked, how humorous I was, STILL NEVER WENT BEYOND that imaginary boundary. This has confused me for the longest and frustrated me to the point where I just gave up trying. After hearing your analysis, I think I just might have faith in expressing my desire for non-black men again. But tell me this, how is it that they are the one's who are in position of power (both male and white), yet they feel they cannot openly love and date who they want regardless of race? I think they dream this up in their mind somehow, because I certainly am not imposing it. Bottom line, I don't like my school, look forward to graduating, and will make it a point to move out of the country. I have grown increasingly wary of American males as well. My personal experiences with them have been very shabby.
I agree with K. I remember this mainly being the case in middle school. "So & so is soo cute" so therefore the rest of us had to think so too otherwise we were crazy or something. Now, its not so much a race thing as it's "is he/she good enough for you/do they treat you well." Some are curious as to whether I prefer wm or bm, (I do prefer wm, but I'm open to any man as long as he's a good man), but they don't respond with "you have weird/bad taste." My friends are white, so I don't know if maybe that influences anything.
@Emeritus
i used to be one of the naija girls saying that she'd only date good looking white guys. for me it was because anytime i was with a group of my nigerian girlfriends and i'd say that i wouldn't mind dating a white guy, there'd be this tension and i'd say that to diffuse it.
If your friends are closed or opposed to IR another question should be not if friends influence taste but how you choose your friends. I know in my younger years, in an extremely homogenous area, tastes are how people divided. Usually musical tastes, but other things as well.
I am aware that race, at least for white people, is not a usual topic for discussion, hence many racial preff. go un recognized or at least never verbalized, but if you find yourself outside the noem of all your friends it may be time for some introspection on how you fell in with such a group.
Of course friends influence taste.
@ emeritus
My friends pretty much think like yours lol that if they date a white guy he has to be the best looking guy ever or have money. Usually it’s like you said the girl is not that attractive herself, so I get annoyed when people say that. I date who I like so friends know not to try “the you should be dating black guys” thing with me. My friends are like if I was approach by two guys one black and one Indian. I'm more likely to pick the Indian guy then the black one. But I also agree with Grata some American born white males have the I’m too precious to date black girl thing when they’re in college. That’s why I tend to date older guys at least over the age of 26.
"But I see nothing wrong with admiring a hot 21 year old NBA player. I think I like the fact that they are still in shape and so many guys my age have let themselves go."Don't I know it. I see so many attractive college guys who are in shape, but they're too young to have a deep conversation with. And the guys my age (late 20's) are already balding and have bellies from drinking a six-pack a day, yet they want an attractive woman who takes care of herself. Who are they kidding?! But seriously, where's that perfect balance of looks and intelligence?
I'd get teased mercilessly for showing an interest in White guys when I was younger, but nowadays people are more accepting. And the people I who associate with are a pretty diverse group. Though my family's not a big fan of interracial dating, I don't care what they think because who I date is my concern only, not theirs.
friends totally influence our tastes in all the ways you outlined, siditty, and then some. how lucky are we, then, as grown ass men and women, that WE CAN CHOOSE OUR FRIENDS. we can gently and tactfully, but firmly include people in our circle who support us and keep everyone else at arm's length? how lucky are we to have that kind of freedom?
Anyone in my "space" influences me, but I don't let people in my space who can't handle that I'm attracted to men, regardless of race.
I don't go around blasting the fact that some of my exes aren't black, but it's not a fact I hide, either.
ieishah,
You're so right that, as ADULTS, we're fortunate to be able to choose our circle of friends and keep out those who aren't supportive of us.
This is why I don't have much sympathy or respect for the WM/NON-WM in my life who claimed to be attracted to BW but were too COWARDLY to pursue them for serious dating and/or marriage relationships for fear of what their friends might think. As adults we're responsible for our (major/minor)life choices and if we let friends (or even family) determine who we should date and/or marry, we're behaving like children, not mature/responsible adults.
Siddity,
I know the BW who started the menloveblackwomen site and can vouch for it as being a legit, excellent dating site. The ladies should definitely check it out.
"But tell me this, how is it that they are the one's who are in position of power (both male and white), yet they feel they cannot openly love and date who they want regardless of race? I think they dream this up in their mind somehow, because I certainly am not imposing it."
Its all in the history and society's perception of the Black female. A black female to be almost accepted in American white society she has to be a high achiever probably alot more accomplished than the white man she is with. That is when it can become ALMOST okay. In essense she has to be more than her man and any protential mates of his. This is not to say that there are no women that are involved that have less than the WM. But I suspect that their acceptability levels in their partner's community are respective of their individual achievements. Or they have really tough husbands that fight for them. The odds against these relationships are just too high for them exist in big numbers. And we should stop asking why there are not that many but rather understand why they are not numerous.
Chris Rock made a joke out of this fact once. He said that when he sees a white male with a Black female she she must be an astronaut. Something to that effect. Its important Black women understand this reality no matter how attracted you are to WM and how they respond. Some things in this society are constant. Fortunately European men don't have the same complexes as American WM. I wouldn't lose hope on White American men but I would be extra cautious given the reality.
"I've pretty much let it be known to my Nigerian Student Assoc on campus that I am interested in white men, that love comes in all colors and that I am perfectly willing to tap into that universal abundance (as I like to call it)."
Personally my own preferances are my business really. My friends are not that important to influence who I date especially racially. If they object to the person's character then they have my ears otherwise, the rest they have to say is insignificant. There is nothing about the challenges of being with a person of another race they need to warn me about that I don't already know.
People who would object are my sisters. They swear they can't marry WM men. And that is their choice, not mine. They always go on and on about how they can't do it. But everytime I show them someone I am interested in and he is white, they don't have much to say because they know they can't move a mountain. They go completely silent.
And besides I think I have much better judgement than them.
Siditty, I guess I don't understand why it's expected that I pick a racial preference. Truth be told I'm way more attracted to those lovely intangible aspects I just can't identify readily. My friends think my choices in men are strange and random...prompting them to laugh out loud sometimes when they see exactly who I'm drawn to. The common link between these men are that they are real oddballs. But I'm an oddball too, so the whole attempt at a relationship/dating whatever you want to call it, is so overwhelming. Every last one of the planets must align, and I'll tell you, on the rare occasion that happens, you really think I give a damn what anybody thinks? Right now I just want to be in a relationship with someone who gets me. That's it. (talllll order)
I agree that group polarization can affect your preferences in men you date. I think when I hang around a group of black women, they tend to only focus on the black men. I like black men but also like other men of other races that I find to be attractive. I think when I mention someone like Gerard Butler or Wentworth Miller. I get the "ugggh you like white boys" and it's not just that lol. I just find whatever is attractive to me. When I in a multi-cultural setting of women, it's different. I really don't get that much criticism.
What an interesting post. Friends do influence but I wouldn't deny my taste... Easy for me to say right? I'm married.
Well, before that I dated all sorts of guys, friends got over it. When i go back to Atlanta some friends still give me weird looks or ask question about it. I even had one friend at Morehouse told me he could never marry a white woman because of what his friends and family would say. He said I was "brave" for marrying a white man. Interesting, no?
Anyway, I was the first black woman my husband dated and we didn't experience any problems on his side. I was a tad bit surprised.
Your friends do influence your taste, however you have to be responsibility for your own life and you have to make your own decisions.
Like the man behind the blog (Beautiful Black Woman) I'm also from Sweden (but with mixed background).
I don't have any preferences when it comes to dating and if I had I wouldn't care what friends told me.
All of my life, people have tried to talk me out of being attracted to WM. It hasn't worked so far. I guess you have to come to a point where you just have to stop living for other people's approval and just do what makes you happy, not because it is socially acceptable. I love the Beautiful Black Woman Blog. It made me realize how much I missed C-1's blog. BTW, where is he?
"It made me realize how much I missed C-1's blog. BTW, where is he?"
Poor C1. We beat him about when he is around and then we want him back when he leaves, LOL!
"Poor C1. We beat him about when he is around and then we want him back when he leaves, LOL!"
I feel bad for him, he must be really confused or something.I'm starting to actually believe that its nearly impossible for this kind of thing to work out. If you're a white man who loves being white and a black woman who is proud of being black, then I'm honestly starting to believe an interracial relationship may not work for you. I feel like one person almost has to "let go," of their identity to have a good marriage and the race has to be put aside and that means one or both people have to divorce themselves from their identity. I'm really upset.
Anon,
It can work, at least it has for me the past nine years.
I'm not all that special so I would assume others could do it as well.
"I feel like one person almost has to "let go," of their identity to have a good marriage and the race has to be put aside and that means one or both people have to divorce themselves from their identity. I'm really upset."
I think its very challenging. But for a Black and White American it shouldn't be that bad. American cultures are used to reinvention. I think its much easier for two Americans to make it than say an American and An African. These are on opposite ends of the Culture intensity spectrum.
Personally I can't let go of my culture so anyone that requires me to do it would not work for me. If I am to have children, I must raise them in my culture. I can't compromise on that.
Europeans seem to be flexible in that regard. Americans don't get the idea of one clinging to "ancient" cultures.
Anon:
"I feel like one person almost has to "let go," of their identity to have a good marriage and the race has to be put aside and that means one or both people have to divorce themselves from their identity. I'm really upset."It does feel this way @ times but it doesn't necessarily have to be so. I, like Grata couldn't compromise my culture to be with someone.
I for one don't care. I tell everyone I know I like white men. All the women I work with (black women) know I like white men and they are either dating or married to black men. The hispanic women I work with are with hispanic men. I guess you can say I'm the odd one out, but I know what I like and I could care less what someone else thinks. This is my life and I'm the only one that has to live it. By the way, great blog.
I personally couldn't care less what the opinions of others are concerning whom I do or do not date. If it works out or doesn't work out, it is me....and not them who enjoy it or suffer for it.
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